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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers.oxz
PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2015 5:52 pm 
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Quote:
Hallo Redspear i just installed it and gave it a go.
I have to say that I love it. It gives variety to the game.
Hi mohawk. Great, thanks for posting :D
Quote:
So if I understand correctly the ingram models are same as the standard game lasers.
But so far I only encountered ingram military lasers available. are the other models more high tech?
Yes, the Ingram models are just the core lasers renamed. I haven't changed their profiles so that sounds like a bug. Thanks for the report.
Quote:
I also love the colour coding touch. It is informative. you can make out who is firing the long range laser an who's laser is more high powered and mast be evaded at close courters :D
Again, great, that's the plan. I should probably make a subtle change to the colours of the Ergon lasers, slightly duller/brighter than their Ingram counterparts perhaps...
Quote:
Also I really like the idea of having a more powerful shorter range laser for my side lasers that I mostly use point blank!
Two different players and already two different strategies, I'm very pleased with that. :)
Quote:
just out of curiosity, now that we can manipulate lasers in the game, is it possible to make lasers have power relative to distance?
you know like less power in long range, normal for mid range and more at point blank :?:
Norby explains that pretty well I think. There's probably a way to do it by script somehow but that's not on my to-do list just yet.

The main reason this oxz is only version 0.2 is that there are quite a few things I might like to add to or develop within this expansion pack. Some of the changes in 1.81 made this stuff so much easier...

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers.oxz
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2015 7:07 pm 
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I've tinkered with this new 1.82 feature, and came up with an interesting lineup of weapons.

First, the native 1.82 lasers, slightly tweaked. A bit more punch, but still pretty wimpy; the weapons the pirates would normally use on you.
Code:
(
		3, 4000, "Pulse Laser",
		"EQ_WEAPON_PULSE_LASER",
		"High powered pulse laser, a basic defence configuration.",
		{
			condition_script = "oolite-conditions.js";
			available_to_all = true;
			weapon_info = {
				range = 15000;
				energy = 0.5;
				damage = 8.0;
				recharge_rate = 0.5;
				shot_temperature = 6.0;
				color = "redColor";
				threat_assessment = 0.0;
			};
		}
	),
        (
		5, 10000, "Beam Laser",
		"EQ_WEAPON_BEAM_LASER",
		"Rapid cycle laser, delivers more energy in less time for more effective results.",
		{
			condition_script = "oolite-conditions.js";
			available_to_all = true;
			weapon_info = {
				range = 15000;
				energy = 0.5;
				damage = 8.0;
				recharge_rate = 0.1;
				shot_temperature = 5.0;
				color = "yellowColor";
				threat_assessment = 0.5;
			};

		}
	),
        (
		7, 8000, "Mining Laser",
		"EQ_WEAPON_MINING_LASER",
		"High power, slow recharge. Ideal for mineral extraction from large asteroids.",
		{
			condition_script = "oolite-conditions.js";
			available_to_all = true;
			weapon_info = {
				range = 12500;
				energy = 1.4;
				damage = 50.0;
				recharge_rate = 2.5;
				shot_temperature = 10.0;
				color = "blueColor";
				is_mining_laser = 1;
				threat_assessment = -0.5;
			};
		}
	),
        (
		10, 60000, "Military Laser",
		"EQ_WEAPON_MILITARY_LASER",
		"Increased power beam laser, developed for Naval use.",
		{
			condition_script = "oolite-conditions.js";
			available_to_all = true;
			weapon_info = {
				range = 30000;
				energy = 1.1;
				damage = 18.0;
				recharge_rate = 0.1;
				shot_temperature = 7.0;
				color = "magentaColor";
				threat_assessment = 1.0;
			};
		}
	),
Next, "enhanced" versions of the above: pre-1.82 shot power, runs a little cooler, priced a bit higher...
Code:
(
		3, 4500, "Enhanced Pulse Laser",
		"EQ_WEAPON_EPULSE_LASER",
		"High powered pulse laser, a basic defence configuration. Enhanced for improved performance.",
		{
			condition_script = "oolite-conditions.js";
			available_to_all = true;
			weapon_info = {
				range = 16000;
				energy = 0.6;
				damage = 15.0;
				recharge_rate = 0.4;
				shot_temperature = 3.0;
				color = "redColor";
				threat_assessment = 0.1;
			};
		}
	),
        (
		6, 12000, "Enhanced Beam Laser",
		"EQ_WEAPON_EBEAM_LASER",
		"Rapid cycle laser, delivers more energy in less time for more effective results. Enhanced for improved performance.",
		{
			condition_script = "oolite-conditions.js";
			available_to_all = true;
			available_to_NPCs = false;
			weapon_info = {
				range = 16000;
				energy = 0.6;
				damage = 15.0;
				recharge_rate = 0.1;
				shot_temperature = 3.0;
				color = "yellowColor";
				threat_assessment = 0.55;
			};

		}
	),
        (
		11, 65000, "Enhanced Military Laser",
		"EQ_WEAPON_EMILITARY_LASER",
		"Increased power beam laser, developed for Naval use. Enhanced for improved performance.",
		{
			condition_script = "oolite-conditions.js";
			available_to_all = true;
			available_to_NPCs = false;
			weapon_info = {
				range = 31000;
				energy = 1.2;
				damage = 23.0;
				recharge_rate = 0.1;
				shot_temperature = 4.25;
				color = "magentaColor";
				threat_assessment = 1.0;
			};
		}
	),
A couple of niche market weapons, just because...
Code:
(
4, 5000, "Super Pulse Laser",
	"EQ_WEAPON_SPULSE_LASER",
	"Enhanced Pulse, tweaked up to deliver a little extra punch.",
	{
			condition_script = "oolite-conditions.js";
			available_to_all = true;
			weapon_info = {
				range = 17000;
				energy = 0.65;
				damage = 17.0;
				recharge_rate = 0.35;
				shot_temperature = 3.2;
				color = "orangeColor";
				threat_assessment = 0.125;
			};
		}
	),
        (
		8, 20000, "Burst Laser",
		"EQ_WEAPON_BURST_LASER",
		"A high output, rapid cycle, pulsed-fire dogfighting weapon. An older milspec design, crude and brutal. Recommended for small ships with a single laser mount.",
		{
			condition_script = "oolite-conditions.js";
			available_to_all = true;
				weapon_info = {
				range = 17500;
				energy = 0.75;
				damage = 19.75;
				recharge_rate = 0.2;
				shot_temperature = 3.5;
				color = "purpleColor";
				threat_assessment = 0.75;
			};
		}
	),
And finally, a "Big Frikin' Gun". An uber weapon surely, offset by it being rare, expensive, and slurps down your energy like a biker guzzles beer.
Code:
(
	12, 80000, "Heavy Military Laser",
	"EQ_WEAPON_HMILITARY_LASER",
	"This is the infamous LF90 - a powerful, advanced, heavy military laser, or as some Navy jocks call it, 'the Business'. Thargoids hate it, pirates fear it, and for a very good reason. The LF90 boasts an unequalled performance; it is without doubts the Deadliest Death-Ray of Death(tm). If your business is killing, then 'the Business' is good. WARNING: This weapon has a high energy demand. Install of an energy unit is strongly recommended.",
	{
			condition_script = "oolite-conditions.js";
			available_to_all = true;
			portable_between_ships = true;
			requires_clean = true;
			available_to_NPCs = false;
			weapon_info = {
				range = 37000;
				energy = 5.0;
				damage = 32.0;
				recharge_rate = 0.150;
				shot_temperature = 4.5;
				color = "cyanColor";
				threat_assessment = 1.0;
			};
		}
	),
By all means, have fun with these. :D

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers.oxz
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2015 7:45 pm 
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The man/lizard/thing was, and continues to be a bit of a code ninja.

Interesting options. :)

Ideas for heavy hitting, but heat hungry, items also pew pew lasers low damage but 0 heat. And every variation in between.

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers.oxz
PostPosted: Sat Jun 06, 2015 11:47 pm 
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Quote:
...it is without doubts the Deadliest Death-Ray of Death(tm)...
"If a thing's worth doing, it's worth overdoing", eh? :lol:

Yes, this is an easy one to tinker with (hey, even I could make it :P ) but you've made me think I should probably post some sort of chart/comparison of the laser weapons in this thing so that it's easier for others to see what they'd like to change for their game.

Thanks :)

Meanwhile, 0.3 is nearly ready (just a little testing to do) and will include one of the few lasers that I'd left out from the original elite manual, the Dual laser.

What is a dual laser? Well, given that it was equipped by Sidewinders (according to the manual), I decided it could still fire from a single point, like all of the others (phew...) so that the 'dual' aspect would be two lasers taking turns to fire down the same barrel as a crude strategy for increasing fire rate. A sort of step between a pulse and a beam laser: still limited range but faster fire than the pulse laser. How much sense any of that makes from a physics or design point of view is something I'm choosing not to dwell on...

In case this might made the typical sidewinder a little two formidable, I made two versions: one nearer the pulse laser in performance and one nearer the beam. I've given the former to the sidewinder template and the latter to escorts. It has a dark blue colour.

Other changes include
  • 'properly' allocating lasers to pirate versions of the templates
  • tweaked colours for the Ergon lasers so that they might be distinguishable from, yet similar to, their Ingram counterparts
  • the ColtMaster Starlaser (that might be the last from the manual now I think?... good job as I'm running out of colours :mrgreen: ) a medium-long range weapon that's more economical than powerful. Colour is a dull cyan (...if I remember).
Should be an update soon.

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers.oxz
PostPosted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 2:00 am 
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Quote:
Quote:
...it is without doubts the Deadliest Death-Ray of Death(tm)...
"If a thing's worth doing, it's worth overdoing", eh? :lol:
Look Ma! I got a sense of humor! :P

I played the C64 version of Elite back in the day. In that version of the game, the military laser offered to the player was absolutely an uber weapon; it could end an argument with a single pirate with a short blast, exterminate a Thargoid warship with a slightly longer blast. But why get up close and personal, when it could be used as a standoff weapon, and totally obliterate a pirate pack at the edge of scanner range with sustained fire, well before they got in range to shoot back... and all this while barely warming up, but I recall you needed an energy unit to operate it.
Once you obtained one, you were pretty much an unstoppable badass.

The manual referred to it as the "Lance & Ferman LF90 Tactical Military Laser".

_________________
Running Oolite buttery smooth & rock stable w/ tons of eyecandy oxps on:
ASUS Prime X370-A
Ryzen 5 1500X
16GB DDR4 3200MHZ
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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers.oxz
PostPosted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 8:48 am 
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Quote:
I played the C64 version of Elite back in the day. In that version of the game, the military laser offered to the player was absolutely an uber weapon; it could end an argument with a single pirate with a short blast, exterminate a Thargoid warship with a slightly longer blast. But why get up close and personal, when it could be used as a standoff weapon, and totally obliterate a pirate pack at the edge of scanner range with sustained fire, well before they got in range to shoot back... and all this while barely warming up, but I recall you needed an energy unit to operate it.
Once you obtained one, you were pretty much an unstoppable badass.

The manual referred to it as the "Lance & Ferman LF90 Tactical Military Laser".
Interesting... No such luck on the speccy version as I recall (although the mil laser was impressive).

Yes, "Lance & Ferman's entry into the laser market", I was forgetting that when I made all of the standard lasers 'Ingram' models. Later on I might limit laser availability by ship (less popular for some I suspect but very much where I'd like this to go in my game). The Cobra III used the Ingram laser system, so... Maybe there should remain a small group of lasers available to all ships (currently, everything's available to everyone).

More food for thought. Thanks again.

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers.oxz
PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 5:58 pm 
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OK, so a tidy-up. Choice and variety is good but not when it's bewildering.
With that and mohawk's feedback in mind: 8 laser colours assigned to 8 laser types, each with 2 varieties.
  • Red: Pulse lasers - budget
    • Ingram (range) and Ergon (cool-running) models
  • Orange: Defence lasers - slow heat up (yet reasonable fire-rate)
    • Ingram MegaBlast (power) and Dual 22-18 (speed) models
  • Brown: Variscan lasers - multi-purpose (including mining)
    • Volt (power) and Hassoni (budget) models
  • Yellow: Beam lasers - rapid-fire
    • Ingram (range) and Ergon (cool-running) models
  • Green: Burst lasers - dogfighting
    • Hassoni-Kruger (budget) and ColtMaster (power) models
  • Cyan: Cannon lasers - sniping
    • Hassoni HiRad (power) and ColtMaster Starlaser (speed)
  • Blue: Mining lasers - specialist
    • Ingram (standard) and JK (budget) models
  • Magenta: Military lasers - combat versatility
    • Lance & Ferman (range) and Ergon (cool-running) models
That covers al of the lasers mentioned in the original manual (I think...) albeit with some artistic licence. Just one more has been added to give the 16 lasers above.

This should enable players to gert a sense of what they're dealing with in terms of lasers and even ships in some cases.

Update very soon I hope...

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers v0.3.oxz
PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2015 11:26 pm 
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Updated to 0.3 (available from the in-game manager).

Lasers as in previous post plus some adjustments to pricing, descriptions, performance and availabilty.
Pirate versions of ships are now affected by this oxp too :twisted:
Oh, and the typical viper now has an orange laser! :shock:

Should all be working but I would be interested in feedback re: pricing and performance.

Thanks.

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers v0.3.oxz
PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2015 12:00 am 
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Now far be it from me , insert whatever blurb befits...but there was this .....http://aegidian.org/bb/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=11914 ...Which includes the LF 180.

Basically . if we are to have access to a pop gun. we are probably going to need a stupidly expensive monstrosity also ..

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers v0.3.oxz
PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2015 2:25 pm 
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Quote:
pricing and performance
Check the [wiki]New lasers[/wiki] table for comparsion.

I think the Defence and VariScan types are too similar and I missing a very short range (5-6km) but powerful class able to mining also, so I suggest to leave the defences as is and change the range of the cheaper multipurpose one to 5km, the expensive one to 6km, both damages to 50 and keep the rate and heat (0.4 and 7-8). This raise the combat performance from beam to military grade regarding damage/seconds. In exchange the cost of these should be doubled (1900 and 3000) at least.

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers v0.3.oxz
PostPosted: Sat Jun 13, 2015 10:41 pm 
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Quote:
...Basically . if we are to have access to a pop gun. we are probably going to need a stupidly expensive monstrosity also ..
Hi Duggan. I haven't really included a 'pop gun', or at least no more so than the standard pulse laser. True, the JK laser is short ranged and weak but it does function as a budget mining laser.

Personally, I'd rather avoid creating a 'Super-Duper-Uber-Pooper-Scooper Death-Dealer 4000' but it seems like you're not the only one interested in such and so I could include a commented out model in the 0.4 release. Has the 'unpack oxz to oxp' feature been implemented yet?

Have you tried the Assault laser? 10,000 credits and it kicks serious bottom, albeit at a shorter range than the military laser. Maybe it could kick a little more looking at that table...
Quote:
Check the [wiki]New lasers[/wiki] table for comparsion.
Thanks Norby, I haven't checked all of the facts and figures but displaying them like that is a good idea.
Quote:
I think the Defence and VariScan types are too similar and I missing a very short range (5-6km) but powerful class able to mining also, so I suggest to leave the defences as is and change the range of the cheaper multipurpose one to 5km, the expensive one to 6km, both damages to 50 and keep the rate and heat (0.4 and 7-8). This raise the combat performance from beam to military grade regarding damage/seconds. In exchange the cost of these should be doubled (1900 and 3000) at least.
That's interesting. Until just before the latest release, defence lasers had a shot tempersature of 3 but that meant they were extremely forgiving in terms of accuracy and so I upped it to 4. Maybe 3.5 would be better and give them a more distinct feeling to the Variscan lasers.

The idea with the VariScan models (I think it was just "Variscan" in the manual) was to make a laser with both reach and mining capabilty, reasonable power and yet poor heat control and energy consumption; a weapon that could adjust to the target (or appear to). One of the problems with this is that it is easy to make the mining lasers a very poor second choice.

I could reduce the VS lasers' recharge rate (they're meant to be old tech - equipped on Cobra MkIs and Pythons) but the 'Volt' model at least, was meant to hit fairly hard. Shortening their range is something else I could do (arguing that their range was good a few hundred years ago) but perhaps not by as much as you suggest.

I could give the JK laser more power but for a mining laser you have to get close anyway for scooping. So it's hard to really downgrade a mining laser in any other way given that mining is far less time critical than combat.

Thanks for your thoughts.

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers v0.3.oxz
PostPosted: Sun Jun 14, 2015 7:21 am 
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Quote:
Has the 'unpack oxz to oxp' feature been implemented yet?
Yes - select an installed OXZ in the manager and press "x".

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers v0.3.oxz
PostPosted: Sun Jun 14, 2015 1:40 pm 
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Thanks cim.

OK then, for those wanting something a little more extreme/silly I'm considering including these things (likely to be commented out so that you'd need to enable them by simple plist editing).

Pulse laser: the Frontier-Newton Yr1993 PlasmaCharger. Much like a standard pulse laser except that it kills things. Colour: thargoid green.

Defence laser: the Williams PewPew 1982 ('R'-type model). Make laser overheating a thing of the past (along with careful aiming) with this medium fire-rate laser. Colour: rose (whatever that is).

VariScan laser: ZeusCorp's Thunderbolt will smash up pretty much anything into little bits. Not the fastest fire rate but it 'packs a wallop'. Colour: white/yellow.

Beam laser: the Lucas NegForce (SithField) Generator fires a stream of intense, awe-inspiring energy at the target over medium range. According to some, the awe wears off after several uses. Colour: pink.

Burst laser: the QVC Ubertron 4000 can be yours for a bargain price with this one-time limited edition special offer. Make other pilots regret 'looking at you funny' with just a second or two of trigger action. Satisfaction guaranteed... Not recommended for the short tempered. Colour: white.

Laser Cannon: the mysterious DeXM-trope DoomLens is hard to find but extremely formidable. Aim, fire, kill; only the first one is difficult. This will suck energy like nobodies business. Colour: black (of course).

Mining laser: the Anderson ITC 'Belter' Sp.(1999) hits with such a hard radioactive blast that it's amazing any of the rock survives. Can be used under duress to do similar to ships. Exhibits a strange technology ahead of its years. Colour: azure (I'm struggling here).

Military Laser: introducing the RimmerAce Quadcooled ImpasseResolver. Yes, it's four times 'cooler' than any other military laser and is also the four times winner of the 'shiniest barrel' award. It just oozes class (in a leak-free, non-radiation hazard sense of course). Colour: blue/green.

So, do people really want this stuff in there?

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers v0.3.oxz
PostPosted: Sun Jun 14, 2015 2:20 pm 
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Hello Redspear,

I am bad with the zippier targets to such an extent that I am compelled to use Okti's Target Tracker OXP. I think having a laser that needs only two or three hits will help mitigate the need for having such a clearly advantagious OXP installed and render the game a little more , not less challenging. As it stands at the current . Without my Target tracker , I cannot lock on to anything more than breifly. So it's a yes from me.

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 Post subject: Re: New Lasers v0.3.oxz
PostPosted: Sun Jun 14, 2015 3:27 pm 
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Quote:
Hello Redspear,

I am bad with the zippier targets to such an extent that I am compelled to use Okti's Target Tracker OXP. I think having a laser that needs only two or three hits will help mitigate the need for having such a clearly advantagious OXP installed and render the game a little more , not less challenging. As it stands at the current . Without my Target tracker , I cannot lock on to anything more than breifly. So it's a yes from me.
Well, that's as good a reason for having an 'uber-weapon' as I've heard.

So next question is do I 'comment' them out (i.e. place "//" before them in the equipment.plist file) so that it is for each user to enable them, or... do we need/want "New Lasers Uber Edition"?

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